∞ Occupy Wall Street people, stop complaining

Marcelo Somers:

Occupy Wall Street (and all the associated movements) completely defies what is amazing about today. I hate it because it’s sending young people every wrong message. Instead of inspiring the youth of today to create amazing things that add value to the world, it’s inspiring them to complain. Get out of the park and rethink the finance industry. Instead of protesting their ways, build something so great that society has to listen to what you’re doing, and take them down.


  • http://twitter.com/GregGehr Greg Gehr

    That’s it.  I will start my own redesigned multi-national bank!  I also think for the logo, I should photograph an actual unicorn caught in the act of pooping rainbows.  

  • Anonymous

    That dude needs to stop complaining and create his own occupy wall street movement

  • http://mangochut.net/ mangochutney

    “Yes OWS protestors, you need to build something great yourself! Until you do, just leave those scumbags be, let them wreak havoc, rob you blind and destroy your work before you can even finance the most basic idea.”

    What a load of crap. 

  • Anonymous

    Personally, I’d be more inclined to join #OccupyCancun, especially at this time of year.

    :-)

  • http://www.theuniversalsteve.com Anonymous

    I disagree with the author’s interpretation of the core of the OWS movement. It’s not about complaining. It’s about raising public awareness. I think that goal is being accomplished. Just look at how “the 99%” and “the 1%” has rocketed into the public lexicon. After public awareness is raised and enough people realize that the current system is detrimental to their best interests is when the system can start to be changed (or a new system can be forged).

    That said, I think the odds of succeeding are low. I’ve pretty much given up hope that we working-class people can stop the consolidation of wealth.

  • http://www.yourmaclifeshow.com/ Shawn King

    “I’ve considered this approach too, but decided to leave them on.” Could you elucidate (look it up :) ) on the reasonings why you’ve considered it and why you’re leaving them on?

    • Vamsmack

      Jim derives joy from my witty commentary.

  • http://www.thegraphicmac.com JimD

    From what I’ve seen, The Loop has a pretty nice following of fairly reasonable commenters. I’ve seen very little trolling and overly obnoxious comments here.

    Unless it gets out of hand, it engages many readers. I’ve actually found a few people in the comments here that I ended up following on Facebook/Twitter/G+, etc. that I normally would have never found.

    • http://www.tenfingercrunch.com Michael Bartholomew

      The Loop community has been great, and the comments have (usually) been insightful and informative.

    • http://www.loopinsight.com Jim Dalrymple

      Exactly.

    • http://www.theuniversalsteve.com Anonymous

      I agree. Most of the time, the comments here add to my enjoyment of the site. Of course, increasing popularity will bring hoards of trolls, so I imagine some day you will have to go Matt’s route. That will be a sad day.

      • http://www.yourmaclifeshow.com/ Shawn King

        “increasing popularity will bring hoards of trolls, so I imagine some day you will have to go Matt’s route.”

        Possibly. But with vigilance (on The Loop’s part) and restraint (on the part of posters), it doesn’t have to be that way.

        One of the things I do is restrain from commenting in kind to trolls. It’s simple enough to keep your ire in check when you see them post. Ignore them and they’ll eventually go away.

        • http://www.thegraphicmac.com JimD

          “Ignore them and they’ll eventually go away.”

          I don’t know, sometimes it appears they have nothing better to do.

    • http://www.yourmaclifeshow.com/ Shawn King

      “it engages many readers.”

      Not exactly. As the original story points out (and I’m sure Jim would agree with), the ratio of pageviews to comments is vanishingly small. And the vast majority of people who post are frequent posters – like us. :)

      • http://www.thegraphicmac.com JimD

        That’s precisely what I mean though. It’s not that it brings new readers in, but for those who are here anyway, it keeps us here longer because we enjoy reading the comments.

        Now of course there are exceptions. If you’ve ever been to the comment section of TechCrunch, you will have witnessed why many bloggers have removed comments from their sites. It’s a complete and total troll-fest that nearly brings me to stab myself in the throat with a pencil.

        • http://www.yourmaclifeshow.com/ Shawn King

          “It’s a complete and total troll-fest…”

          While that is primarily the blame of the trolls, web sites must take some responsibility. You can’t just open your site up to the internet without taking some form of positive policing action. If it means hiring moderators, I believe successful web sites should do that.

          As another poster said, I like being able to comment directly on a post. Not everyone is a blogger who can respond to what they read on their own site.

          But there’s no doubt that web sites like TechCrunch and their ilk have little (commenting) value to me because they don’t moderate their commenters.

          • Steven Fisher

            I think the TechCrunch problem is that the trolling starts in the articles, and extends down through the comments. There’s little point in moderating comments when the article is so bad to begin with.

    • http://twitter.com/obamapacman ObamaPacman

      Yup. It’s good to see that there are sane folks online.

    • http://mangochut.net/ mangochutney

      Same here. I come here for the articles, I stay for the wit and the discussions.

      If it ever gets out of hand, I’m going to volunteer as a moderator ;)

  • http://www.smiley-dread.com kiil

    I for one do appreciate those who allow commenting. I do not blog or otherwise submit commentary for publishing on the web which means that sites which do not offer commenting can’t “hear” from me. Although it is possible to send an e-mail; most authors/publishers are too busy to answer whereas a reply is not necessarily what I want. The comment section offers a chance to obtain further information or corrections from others without leaving the page. I get that the web is all about linking, but going back and forth or links that open a new tab/window is a pain in the ass. 

    I am happy that more and more sites are using Disqus which I find to be quite convenient and while not perfect, keeps things sane enough. It is a pleasant surprise when Disqus lets me know that such and such website has joined them and that it appears there exists previous comments that might have been made by me when viewing my profile. That feature of having a single repository of my “wisdom” is what I like best.

    So Jim and Peter — thanks!

    Ian

    PS: I am an American who has been living overseas for over 20 years. Commenting on the web is a grat chance for me to brush up on my English

  • http://twitter.com/zwei zwei

    Comments seem to be decent here in both quantity and quality. It’s when you start seeing 300 troll-laden comments per article (e.g. Engadget) that it becomes pointless.

    Although it wouldn’t upset me to see the comments left for Facebook and Google+ either. Whatever floats your boat.

  • Steven Fisher

    I think there’s a happy medium ground. I don’t have enough readers to bother with designing my pages to accept comments, and the few times I’ve had an article popular enough it’s invariably attracted trolls.

    An anti-Flash article I posted brought them out of the woodwork defending Flash from points I hadn’t even made, and weren’t important.

    A discussion on some of the niceties in iOS brought out Android trolls.

    It just wasn’t worth keeping the ability for troll for the few insightful comments. The Loop seems to really be in a sweet spot for comments right now, where there’s insightful material, and the trolling is infrequent enough that it’s kind of amusing. But I imagine it won’t be there forever.

    (That’s tomorrow’s problem, though.)

  • http://twitter.com/axian A.X. Ian

    Anti-comment angst is usually described in terms of aesthetic choice or as troll/spam control. But I think some blog authors aren’t willing to go and discuss their posts for a number of reasons. It’s hard enough to crank out blog posts on a regular basis. Reading and responding to comments below the article is somewhat of a chore. I get that.

    The anonymity argument is nonsense. Ideas matter. I couldn’t give two fucks about the real name behind the posts.

  • Kelly Miller

    I don’t have a strong feeling about comments either way — it’s your site, so do what you want. There are high quality sites without comments (like Daring Fireball), and high quality sites with high quality comments (like Asymco or The Loop). Of course, there are also low quality sites with low quality comments (like every local newspaper website in the United States).

    On the other hand, Matt Legend Gemmell is occupying a hypocritical middle ground. “I want to make it clear that this isn’t a means to discourage conversation; indeed, I hope the opposite it true.” No Matt, it unquestionably is a means to discourage conversation. Matt claims that comments are for a tiny minority. Running and maintaining a blog is for an even tinier minority. It takes a lot of effort to build a blog of high enough quality that it will be heard. Twitter is perhaps a bit better, but 140 characters at a crack allows perhaps a single sentence. 

    The purpose of turning off comments is to discourage conversation. There’s nothing wrong with that, if that is what you want. But if you really want a conversation, don’t pretend that you are going to get one by turning off comments.

  • http://www.thediceguys.com Dean Lewis

    When setting up my board game blog/site, my friend and I discussed a long time if we wanted to allow comments on the posts and podcasts themselves. I knew if we did, I would use Disqus. As mentioned above, for all its issues, the spam is nigh non-existent and the fact people have to sign in in some way tends to keep the troll element low. (Being able to choose several ways people can log in to post helps with that as well.)

    And we have, for now, set it up with Disqus. We had talked about using the old newspaper/magazine model: send us an email and we would run a mailbox feature once a week and answer what we chose. It’s our site; editorial privilege is ours. But, when it came down to opening time, we knew we just didn’t have the time to dedicate to that kind of email maintenance.

    So, until a few people ruin the fun for all, we have comments.